Inspired Spinal Cord Injury Support Forum

Lαrα
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ASIA Grading Jan 27, 2014 0:21:12 GMT -8

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Post by Lαrα on Jan 27, 2014 0:21:12 GMT -8

Jan 26, 2014 19:54:30 GMT -8 kisch5 said:

So, here's my question, I am ASIA D from what it looks like. I have bladder retention though, doesn't that point to complete cauda equina syndrome? My doctors told me I was 'definitely incomplete' though..

kisch5...if you have retention then you have complete Cauda Equina Syndrome (CESR) but in relation to paraplegia you would be classed as incomplete or ASIA D as per motor function and sensation.

As sci has explained (thankyou sci

in relation to Cauda Equina Syndrome it can be referred to as ASIA A but this confuses more i think because we have motor function below injury level and sensation, although impaired.

I therefor find it easier to consider myself complete in relation to CES but not in relation to the SCI ASIA gradings.

kisch5, this is an explanation on complete/incomplete CES on the form. Take a read and see what you think?

CES Complete or Incomplete

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ASIA Grading Jan 28, 2014 7:05:55 GMT -8

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Post by kisch5 on Jan 28, 2014 7:05:55 GMT -8

I've read this over a few times and I think you're right Lαrα. I think I have CESR despite what my doctors say, although, who knows, I'm six months post op this week. I still have a window for recovery and I'm trying to keep a positive outlook. This frigid weather this winter is not helping anything at all!

kisch5 Member Posts: 190 Post Likes Received: 119 Date Joined: September 2013 Injury: L5/S1 CES incomplete Date Injured: July 2013 Member is: Offline Send PM	ASIA Grading Jan 28, 2014 7:12:07 GMT -8 Quote Select Post Deselect Post Link to Post Back to Top Post by kisch5 on Jan 28, 2014 7:12:07 GMT -8 DJ - I don't think I do DJ, I void every two-three hours

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ASIA Grading Jan 28, 2014 7:39:01 GMT -8

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Post by Lαrα on Jan 28, 2014 7:39:01 GMT -8

Jan 28, 2014 7:05:55 GMT -8 kisch5 said:

I've read this over a few times and I think you're right Lαrα. I think I have CESR despite what my doctors say, although, who knows, I'm six months post op this week. I still have a window for recovery and I'm trying to keep a positive outlook. This frigid weather this winter is not helping anything at all!

Just wondered kisch5 if you were asking the question to a neurosurgeon/consultant? A regular may not be specialized enough to make this assessment to be honest.
If you are retaining then this is an important factor...do you have feeling around your bottom (anus)? If you dont mind me askin...(this is the only place i could ask someone this question

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ASIA Grading Jan 28, 2014 10:19:43 GMT -8

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Post by kisch5 on Jan 28, 2014 10:19:43 GMT -8

Lαrα - my neurologist, neurosurgeon and spinal rehab specialist that I see have all said I was incomplete (I asked that question around a month after my injury to all three). From what I've seen, it seems like my sacral nerves are the ones that are affected. I can feel my quads/fronts on my legs, tops of my feel (L5, I believe). I cannot feel/work the backs of my legs (calves, hamstrings) and I have total saddle anesthesia, apart from the wonderful nerve shocks that start in around 6pm that usually make me sing with glee ! No worries in asking the questions either Lαrα, I am an open book

DJ Administrator STAFF Posts: 8,162 Post Likes Received: 2,829 Date Joined: July 2013 Injury: C6 - ASIA B Date Injured: June 2011 Member is: Offline Send PM	ASIA Grading Jan 31, 2014 7:12:38 GMT -8 Quote Select Post Deselect Post Link to Post Back to Top Post by DJ on Jan 31, 2014 7:12:38 GMT -8 Jan 28, 2014 7:12:07 GMT -8 kisch5 said: DJ - I don't think I do DJ, I void every two-three hours So do you void by cathing or you can actually void on your own?

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ASIA Grading Jan 31, 2014 16:15:33 GMT -8

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Post by kisch5 on Jan 31, 2014 16:15:33 GMT -8

I void on my own every two to three hours DJ. I did Urodynamics, which is probably the most humbling thing I have ever done in my life, and my urologist told me I have a 'safe' bladder for the time being so I didn't need to worry about using a catheter yet. That being said, if I don't get any better, I expect to be doing it in the next few years (the straining isn't easy)..

Butiki Advanced Member Posts: 2,270 Post Likes Received: 1,154 Date Joined: July 2013 Injury: L 3 ASIA B CES Date Injured: 16/11/2012 Member is: Offline Send PM	ASIA Grading Jan 31, 2014 16:19:03 GMT -8 Quote Select Post Deselect Post Link to Post Back to Top Post by Butiki on Jan 31, 2014 16:19:03 GMT -8 Hi kisch5, my only worry would be if you were voiding completely ??? Because as you know any left over urine can affect your kidneys.
	Just do it

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ASIA Grading Jan 31, 2014 21:02:53 GMT -8

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Post by kisch5 on Jan 31, 2014 21:02:53 GMT -8

No worries Butiki, I was checked around a month after my surgery and again 2 months ago during my Urodynamics test. Both times I was able to void completely. To be honest, I probably void more than I actually need to just to make sure I don't run into problems. I also drink a few glasses of cranberry juice daily to help. I picked up most of the info I use from this site off of the bowel and bladder threads.

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DJ Administrator STAFF Posts: 8,162 Post Likes Received: 2,829 Date Joined: July 2013 Injury: C6 - ASIA B Date Injured: June 2011 Member is: Offline Send PM	ASIA Grading Feb 8, 2014 17:00:37 GMT -8 Quote Select Post Deselect Post Link to Post Back to Top Post by DJ on Feb 8, 2014 17:00:37 GMT -8 Ah ok, well in that case, what your doctor told you was right! You're definitely incomplete kisch5
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Knight Advanced Member Posts: 1,407 Post Likes Received: 773 Date Joined: August 2013 Injury: T10 Paraparetic with CES & CMS Date Injured: July 21, 2012 Member is: Offline Send PM	ASIA Grading Feb 10, 2014 3:17:48 GMT -8 via Inspired Mobile Quote Select Post Deselect Post Link to Post Back to Top Post by Knight on Feb 10, 2014 3:17:48 GMT -8 Well, I was never graded on the ASIA scale, but from the looks of it I am ASIA C with complete CES.
	Lαrα likes this Too Pretty to Walk™

Lαrα Global Moderator STAFF Posts: 7,350 Post Likes Received: 3,100 Date Joined: August 2013 Injury: CES Date Injured: March 2011 Member is: Offline Send PM	ASIA Grading Feb 10, 2014 3:20:37 GMT -8 Quote Select Post Deselect Post Link to Post Back to Top Post by Lαrα on Feb 10, 2014 3:20:37 GMT -8 Did they not ASIA grade you in rehab Knight

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ASIA Grading Feb 10, 2014 5:03:09 GMT -8

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Post by Knight on Feb 10, 2014 5:03:09 GMT -8

Feb 10, 2014 3:20:37 GMT -8 Lαrα said:

Did they not ASIA grade you in rehab Knight

No, I was told I was an L1 incomplete SCI. That is all they told me, and it took me a week to get that out of them! I had no idea why I couldn't walk for a week after my accident.

Too Pretty to Walk™

DJ Administrator STAFF Posts: 8,162 Post Likes Received: 2,829 Date Joined: July 2013 Injury: C6 - ASIA B Date Injured: June 2011 Member is: Offline Send PM	ASIA Grading Feb 10, 2014 6:14:11 GMT -8 Quote Select Post Deselect Post Link to Post Back to Top Post by DJ on Feb 10, 2014 6:14:11 GMT -8 That's pretty strange Knight, I wonder why they didn't/wouldn't tell you

Lαrα Global Moderator STAFF Posts: 7,350 Post Likes Received: 3,100 Date Joined: August 2013 Injury: CES Date Injured: March 2011 Member is: Offline Send PM	ASIA Grading Feb 10, 2014 9:46:37 GMT -8 Quote Select Post Deselect Post Link to Post Back to Top Post by Lαrα on Feb 10, 2014 9:46:37 GMT -8 It is strange Knight and DJ because its normally part of the admission and discharge to asses and ASIA grade...it should certainly be on your discharge notes from rehab.

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ASIA Grading

Post by Lαrα on Jan 27, 2014 0:21:12 GMT -8

Post by kisch5 on Jan 28, 2014 7:05:55 GMT -8

Post by kisch5 on Jan 28, 2014 7:12:07 GMT -8

Post by Lαrα on Jan 28, 2014 7:39:01 GMT -8

Post by kisch5 on Jan 28, 2014 10:19:43 GMT -8

Post by DJ on Jan 31, 2014 7:12:38 GMT -8

Post by kisch5 on Jan 31, 2014 16:15:33 GMT -8

Post by Butiki on Jan 31, 2014 16:19:03 GMT -8

Post by kisch5 on Jan 31, 2014 21:02:53 GMT -8

Post by DJ on Feb 8, 2014 17:00:37 GMT -8

Post by Knight on Feb 10, 2014 3:17:48 GMT -8

Post by Lαrα on Feb 10, 2014 3:20:37 GMT -8

Post by Knight on Feb 10, 2014 5:03:09 GMT -8

Post by DJ on Feb 10, 2014 6:14:11 GMT -8

Post by Lαrα on Feb 10, 2014 9:46:37 GMT -8

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