Post by coolguy223 on Sept 29, 2018 7:08:07 GMT -8
Hi I'm writing this for a family member of mine and really want to hear what people think regarding her chances of walking again. About 3 months ago this person was in an accident and had a C6/C7 vertebral injury that caused her to have an incomplete spinal cord injury at C7. She was operated on about 36 hours post-injury. Post-op she began undergoing rehabilitation. Sensation is preserved throughout. She has feeling all the way down to the S3/4/5 dermatome and did so 1 or 2 days post-injury. Post-injury she was able to move her wrists, extend her elbow, but not move her fingers. She also cannot move her legs. She is able to bend all the way down at her waist. About two months post-injury her fingers started to return. She is able to move most digits at this time but only slightly. In addition, around the time that she started regaining finger function she also recovered bladder function. At first I was skeptical regarding her bladder function but post-void ultrasounds consistently showed a normal post-void residual volume. She does have to bend forward at the waist to assist with urinating but she is able to start and stop on her own and does not have any urinary incontinence. My question is this Given that she has recovered bladder function, shouldn't she eventually recover her leg function? Bladder is innervated by sacral nerves and legs are innervated by lumbar through sacral. I've looked online numerous times to try and find cases of people with spinal cord injuries who can use their bladders but not their legs but have not found anything. Given that her injury was in the neck and she is able to use the muscles of her body with the most distal innervation from her level injury I don't see anatomically how she can't be expected to regain her leg muscles. Please feel free to share your opinion as well as any personal experiences regarding something similar.
It’s difficult to say whether your family member will regain the use of her legs. C7 injuries are able to move most of the digits of their hands, with the exception of their little fingers. It is strange that the bladder works and yet she can’t walk. Does the bladder muscle contract to empty and then the sphincter muscle close to prevent leakage? The problem with spinal injury is that no two injuries are the same. People can suffer damage to various spinal cord nerves that control specific parts of their bodies, so I suppose it’s theoretically possible to gain function in one part but not another. It doesn’t have to be logical. There is no logic to it. Good luck to her and I hope she continues to improve.
I would agree with mikeq,, no injury is the same so very difficult to say, also depends a lot on injured persons determination to walk again and persistence at recovery work or exersize.
What Mike said. Impossible to predict as there is too much variety in outcomes. If she cannot yet move her legs at all she may never get further than a poor performance with a walker. Does not matter. The most important thing right no is to focus on hand and arm us. A person can be completely independent if their hands work. Legs? Ask for E-stim a some point and do so from time to time. Electrical stimulation is a proven way of activating muscles with jus a wee bit of nerve enervation. If there is no enervation it is still good for the health.
Hi coolguy223. I am T9 incomplete. I have a little feeling down my body, but it’s sort of like when your circulation is cut off and your leg goes to sleep. I have no useful movement in my leg. I can barely move one toe...on a good day. (One leg was amputated in my accident.) I can urinate by leaning forward. I do this to void. However, I have incontinence, so I always leak and I always wear diapers. My injury was four years ago. Nothing has changed. It’s great that your family member regained bladder function and some finger function, but to give you my honest answer about regaining the ability to walk, I doubt it. Three months is a recent injury, and her surgery may have lined up some nerves that still have a chance to connect. I hope that will happen. But my personal outlook is to be grateful for what I have left and learn to make the most of it.
I'm a C5/6 walker and agree with all above replies. I also bend forward to empty my bladder because my push isnt that strong. There's no rhyme nor reason to who can walk again and who cannot, it all depends on which pathways were damaged in the spinal cord and that can also take time to find out. 3 months is early days
Hi coolguy223 . I am T9 incomplete. I have a little feeling down my body, but it’s sort of like when your circulation is cut off and your leg goes to sleep. I have no useful movement in my leg. I can barely move one toe...on a good day. (One leg was amputated in my accident.) I can urinate by leaning forward. I do this to void. However, I have incontinence, so I always leak and I always wear diapers. My injury was four years ago. Nothing has changed. It’s great that your family member regained bladder function and some finger function, but to give you my honest answer about regaining the ability to walk, I doubt it. Three months is a recent injury, and her surgery may have lined up some nerves that still have a chance to connect. I hope that will happen. But my personal outlook is to be grateful for what I have left and learn to make the most of it.
Vintage, do you have an overactive bladder and have you tried ditropan? I used to use incontinence pads for a lot of years till I started taking ditropan. It took about a week to start working
No, tarabev. You don’t understand at all. My condition is completely different from yours. Nothing that you have suggested has anything to do with the condition I’ve described myself as having. My post was in response to coolguy223 ‘s request for any information that might give him insight into his relative’s prognosis.
I have an incomplete injury at L1. I regained complete bladder and bowel function at 6 weeks from injury. But it took 2 years to get back what leg function I have. I can walk with AFO's and fore arm crutches. I still use my wheelchair for most mobility, it's easier and safer. Like others have said, there is no rhyme or reason to most return. I wish your family member the best, tell her to keep moving what she can move.
Please include me as one of those who say that three months is far too early to tell what will happen. A very good friend of mine was injured in a flying accident and became T12 incomplete. He has worked very hard ever since being injured, and continues to work hard today, even five years later. Recently he told me that it was his fourth year in which he made the most progress! He can now walk unassisted for the length of a football field, even if much of the time he uses lower arm braces to help him. He credits much of his early progress with intensive use of FES bikes. Many rehab facilities these days also use FES off the bike to help clients stand, lie down and raise their legs, and do other exercises. All of which is to say the following: don't give up hope, just work really hard and concentrate on getting strong and healthy.
No, tarabev . You don’t understand at all. My condition is completely different from yours. Nothing that you have suggested has anything to do with the condition I’ve described myself as having. My post was in response to coolguy223 ‘s request for any information that might give him insight into his relative’s prognosis.
Vintage, I was just asking you a question and trying to help, never at any stage did I say that I understood your condition.
I can urinate by leaning forward. I do this to void. However, I have incontinence, so I always leak and I always wear diapers. My injury was four years ago. Nothing has changed.
I can urinate by leaning forward. I do this to void. However, I have incontinence, so I always leak and I always wear diapers. My injury was four years ago. Nothing has changed.
Vintage, for many years I also had to wear incontinence pads, I had no control whatsoever, also had accidents with bowels and ditropan helped me.....as I said, I was just asking you a question because I was genuinely trying to help. I'm also offended that you say I dont understand, I would never say to another sci person on here that they dont understand, we have a great community here and we're all trying to help each other.
For you to get snippy about someones genuine concern is completely against the nature of this site. I will never bother trying to suggest anything to you again because you obviously know everything.
tarabev , in the post you refer to, I hadn’t asked for help. You have described your urinary issues. Mine are completely different from yours.
There have been many times you have mentioned issues (in other peoples topics) that you have and others have given you ideas on what you can do to help yourself without you actually asking them for their opinion and you have thanked them nicely but with me, you got snippy.
But thats fine Vintage, I wont ever give you my thoughts about what you could try to do to make life a little better even though I have been living with my sci for over 20years now.